I know that there is very little in common with what Jesus and Paul set up and with the organization that Joseph Smith and Brigham Young established some 18 centuries later. A perfect example showing how even Mormonism has changed in the 180 years since its creation is the fact that men and women of African descent did not have access to that same fullness until within our lifetime, Evie. Before 1978, if your skin color was black, there was a good chance that salvation was not yours.

There is no Father in Heaven, and the idea that there is one is the root of much distress in this world, as people kill, abuse ecclesiastical authority, and legislate their way of life over one another because they claim to have access to unique truths and authority from this Father.

Children who are the age of eight face tremendous social pressure to join the Church. The church professes a respect for free agency, but did not show it towards my two precocious and questioning children.

His goodness, love, and blessings, in the context of Mormonism, include a Church in which whether or not you have a penis and testicles makes a tremendous difference over the amount of authority, legitimacy and control you have in the organization and over many aspects of your own life, a legacy of racism and polygamy, a professed respect for truth and sincerity that breaks down completely if you are one of the thousands who finds yourself questioning the Church’s story, and a backwards culture of bigotry that devalues gays and crusades to take away their rights.

I did join the Church of my own choice. The Church exerted tremendous social pressure to keep me in, and did not respect me or my free agency to leave in the manner that it welcomed me.

That said, I’m not denying the Church doesn’t do some good. But I’m responding to your one-sided and heavy-handed pronouncement that I consider disrespectful to CatGirl and GameBoy and really does little to address the specifics in this post. I still have respect and affection for you based on our friendship two decades ago, but within the context of public discussion of religion on this blog and elsewhere, I will judge each comment based on the strengths/weaknesses of its arguments.

The faith that John had to be baptized and serve a mission for the Church in Japan has always been an inspiration to me. He did it on his own volition.

If there is a god, I hope that s/he/it understands that.

But really, the only important point is that the Family Remy is happy, loving and contented in their chosen lifestyle. If some god wants to damn them because their journey in this life is different from yours, then that god is kind of a prick.

The relevant part of the song goes: “It never rains in California/But girl, don’t they warn ya/It pours man it pours”.

I should know, when I was at BYU (where I lasted all of two months) I called up one of the local radio stations and requested that song nearly every day. Not that I was homesick or anything. Oh, no. Not at all.

The truth is, it can pour in California. I remember when I was in seventh grade (that’d be, well, a long time ago), it rained for about a month straight, at least in my part of SoCal (Ventura County, then). It was an El Nino year, I think, and I started to think that it wouldn’t ever stop raining.

Your children have a jump start over many of us. I still feel like I’m shedding layers, fine tuning, and evolving my non/beliefs.

I commend you for the courage to physically distance yourself and follow after what feels right. When a religion is more than a Sunday thing but a culture as well, it is not easy. However, great peace comes with actions that mirror beliefs. Tis worth it.

What’s this rain stuff? I thought you were in southern CA and it never rained there. Or did pop music lie to me in my youth?

To be more serious, that was a beautiful post/Sunstone session. I haven’t listened to it online yet – did your kids actually speak at the symposium?

And, it seems like the beach would be a good place for church. There seems to be something mystical and powerful about places where the continents and the oceans meet.

And it always (I repeat: always) seems to end up raining. (Or with such strong winds that we can’t open our eyes unless we want to get sand in them.)

(and church on the beach sounds AWESOME)

In my current situation, Mormonism remains my religious community since (1) I live in Provo; (2) it is the religion of my family, in which they are happiest and best self-identify; and (3) I have many LDS friends.

As a community, the Mormon Church is generally very good; as a spiritual path, well, not so much. It sounds like you have found a way to unite both.

The openness with which your children speak of this is proof that their minds are open and questioning. Congratulations!

I think it is so great that your children have been able to develop their own spiritual identities apart from their parents’, and that they are cognisant enough of the differences to express them.

On my mission in Germany, I found out that there is a law there that forbids parents from forcing their children to attend or join a church after the age of 14. That is, children legally have the right to make up their own minds about religion when they turn 14. I don’t know that a law requiring that would work or be necessary here, but I think it is vitally important that parents allow their children to make up their own minds about religion. I feel that in Mormonism, the pressure is such that even if you don’t believe or have serious doubts, you aren’t free to express them, because of potential shaming by peers, and because you aren’t taught any other kind of reality besides the Mormon one.

I think that this emotionally stunts our growth (I know it did mine), and makes it harder to live in the real world – which isn’t necessarily something many Mormons want to do anyways.

Your children seem a lot more mature and self-aware than many I know – most likely because their parents are willing to show them more than just one small facet of life. And I think that is wonderful.