I promised some posts on Bury the Chains, and I’m so glad that several of you have purchased the book. It’s well worth the investment–Hochschild is not only a fine historian and journalist but a master storyteller. Even if you don’t plan to read it, this question may interest you: When do we choose to work from inside a system we find problematic? When should we be radical and to stand on the outside?
I’m cursed with an idealist bent, so I tend towards the radical. I joined Mormonism because it was the Right Thing to Do (at the time), even though it meant getting disowned by my family. Ultimately, I left Mormonism because it was the Right Thing to Do (risking the possibility of getting ‘disowned’, this time by my church family). Politically, I moved from Libertarian to Independent to Green without ever stepping in Donkey or Elephant doo. I’m a struggling vegetarian, a radical egalitarian, a socialist, a pacifist, a feminist and a user of Macs. I think that Noam Chomsky is sane and that Marx (Karl) had a couple of good ideas.
There is absolutely no doubt that the abolition of the slave trade was a radical idea in Britain in the late 1700s. They had never known a world without slavery. The Bible took slavery for granted (though it had a couple of good stories about escaping bondage) and the UK’s economic prosperity was as dependent on the prosperous slave trade as the US’s is on access to cheap oil.
The main proponents of abolition were a quirky group of dourly dressed religious radicals. The Quakers had been sounding off against slavery for decades, but Brits probably paid as much attention to them as we do when Scientologists march against modern psychiatry. To make matters worse, you had to be a member of the Church of England to hold government office. So it wasn’t until some evangelical Anglicans started tuning in that any practical measures could be taken against the slave trade.
Ultimately, it took the well-established network of Quaker outsiders, radical Anglican agitators like Thomas Clarkson, and highly-placed and dedicated (albeit conservative in almost every other way) insiders like William Wilberforce to launch the successful campaign to mobilize the public sentiment against slavery.
This marriage of the radical and the entrenched is necessary to fight the injustices of today, whether the cause is the abolition of real and virtual modern slavery (perpetuated by global capitalism), the election of a U.S. president with liberal values, or the fight against the oppression of women in the LDS Church. We need radical iconoclasts to jolt those who are embedded out of complacency, to grow uneasy with the status quo. The loud-mouthed, dreaming radicals express the vision and stretch the spectrum of possibilities so that sympathetic moderates can gently nudge or vigorously shove the complacent, social behemoth.
7 responses so far ↓
1 Bored in Vernal // Apr 17, 2007 at 12:02 pm
John,
My post on the first three chapters.
This question of yours just tugs at my soul: “When do we choose to work from inside a system we find problematic? When should we be radical and to stand on the outside?” I’m glad you wrote a little on the importance of all those who are needed to advance a cause, the more strident and disassociated and those who work within the system.
From my perspective of working for change in the LDS Church, I guess I’m always scared that those who leave will move on to other issues and will cease becoming a catalyst for change. Not only are they discounted by insiders, but they often lose their desire to be involved. I mourn over Richard Dutcher’s announcement for this reason. So many of us were hoping for a Joseph Smith film. Now we’ve despaired of seeing that happen. I just hope that those who choose to stand on the outside will retain their passion for Mormon causes.
2 Elise // Apr 17, 2007 at 8:37 pm
BiV - Thanks for your acknowledgement of appreciation for those who retain their passion for Mormon causes even when standing from the outside. The hard part about that, though, from one who stands on the outside, is that your motivations and your loyalties are constantly questioned and doubted. Fair, I suppose, but still hard to put up with.
My individual motivations lie somewhere in between still believing that Joseph Smith experienced something….something spiritual and something of God and something big. I’m not sure what exactly, and I’m not sure exactly how it applies to me or the rest of the world, but I think it applies somehow. The rest I’m still working on. Another motivation is founded in my family, my values, my upbringing, and my heritage.
That said, some of my motivation is also anger and a desire to help others avoid some of the pains I’ve experienced (unnecessarily, IMO). This motivation scares the average member. Scares them a lot - even makes them hate me sometimes. Or at least ignore me.
I think this experience probably crosses borders into many different groups, whether religious or social or family based. Those who spoke out about slavery were probably hated or ignored or feared by those who owned slaves and whose livelihood was based on slavery.
John, I haven’t bought the book yet (grrr….no time for reading during this time of year, too much work!) but I’m totally intrigued. Can’t wait to read your response, too, BiV.
I love the idea of a marriage of the radical and the entrenched. I think I’m a radical in some ways and entrenched in some ways. For example, I’m convinced meat should be consumed sparingly and I do agree that lots of meat has a lot of negative impacts on the environment. But I find it near impossible to go a day without meat! So John, you be the radical in the meat department and I’ll be the entrenched, ok?
Looking forward to more posts on the subject and sorry to ramble so long.
3 John // Apr 17, 2007 at 9:01 pm
Thanks, BiV and Elise, for sharing your thoughts and feelings on this subject. It’s something I’ve given a lot of thought to recently. I’m frustrated at how much time we spend defining ourselves and others, drawing circles of inclusion/exclusion. I don’t want to dismiss this practice–it’s important to know who we are and where we stand, but sometimes I think too much time is spent on this. I’ll go into this more in a later post.
BiV, I can see what you mean about people on the outside giving up. Elise and Jana are both “outsiders” by various definitions, but they both still care deeply about Mormonism and are still actively engaging in it. It’s a hard fight.
I’m one of those who lost the passion for the Mormon cause (sorry, BiV!). I acknowledge that this will seem like a loss from the perspective of some (but not all) in the community, but from my point of view, my passions haven’t changed–just the context.
This is a conversation I’d like to have in person with both of you (and others!). Elise, will you be Sunstoning it this summer?
4 Bored in Vernal // Apr 18, 2007 at 4:36 am
“I‚Äôm one of those who lost the passion for the Mormon cause (sorry, BiV!). I acknowledge that this will seem like a loss from the perspective of some (but not all) in the community, but from my point of view, my passions haven‚Äôt changed‚Äìjust the context.”
I dunno–I think you’re still pretty fascinated with Mormon feminism. I think it might be one of those things you promised the universe you’d engage in, and I don’t think you’ll be able to stay out of it!
Elise, please come to Sunstone!
5 Miko // Apr 18, 2007 at 7:24 am
In any working system, the place of power is always the best place from which to make changes. That often means that any changes in power need to take place there.
6 Elise // Apr 19, 2007 at 7:51 pm
I’m planning on Sunstone - I probably can’t make it all 4 days, but I’m hoping to hit the opening night on Wednesday, and then stay until Friday at lunch or so. I’m very flexible, though, I just want to spend some quality time with family while I’m there, too.
I’d love to participate in a panel or two, so check out my interests here.
John, I’d love to touch base with you there, and BiV, can’t wait to meet you!
7 shana // Apr 20, 2007 at 8:07 pm
Okay,
I am going to have to buy this book. I really enjoyed King Leopolds Ghost.
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