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	<title>Comments on: OC Pilgrimage, Station 02: OC Friends Meeting.</title>
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	<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/</link>
	<description>Religion, SF, and Other Speculative Fictions.</description>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-245</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Mar 2006 07:11:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-245</guid>
		<description>Liz,

Thank you for the helpful links and the introduction to the Quaker blog-world.  I love what I&#039;ve read (in print) from contemporary Quakers like Parker Palmer and Richard Foster--I&#039;m looking forward lurking on Quaker blogs.

Peace,

John</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Liz,</p>
<p>Thank you for the helpful links and the introduction to the Quaker blog-world.  I love what I&#8217;ve read (in print) from contemporary Quakers like Parker Palmer and Richard Foster&#8211;I&#8217;m looking forward lurking on Quaker blogs.</p>
<p>Peace,</p>
<p>John</p>
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		<title>By: Liz Opp</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-244</link>
		<dc:creator>Liz Opp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Mar 2006 04:00:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-244</guid>
		<description>Hi, John.

Not sure how I found your blog, but you might be interested to know that there is an entire &quot;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.quakerquaker.org/quaker_blogs&quot;&gt;Quaker blogosphere&lt;/a&gt;&quot; at your fingertips, and we explore some of the questions and observations you make in this post:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&amp;lr=&amp;q=quaker+blog+dressing+plain&amp;btnG=Search&quot;&gt;dressing plain&lt;/a&gt;

being a &quot;&lt;a href=&quot;http://beppeblog.blogspot.com/2004/09/yet-more-light-on-can-i-be-quaker-and.html&quot;&gt;hyphenated Quaker&lt;/a&gt;&quot;:  Jewish-Quaker, Buddhist-Quaker, etc.

what we do at &lt;a href=http://thegoodraisedup.blogspot.com/2006/02/stages-of-worship.html&quot;&gt;Meeting for Worship&lt;/a&gt;

etc.

Another resource for recent posts among Friends is the website &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.quakerquaker.org&quot;&gt;QuakerQuaker&lt;/a&gt;.

Nice to learn some about the Church of Latter Day Saints while doing my blog-browsing tonight.

Blessings,
Liz, &lt;a href=&quot;http://thegoodraisedup.blogspot.com&quot;&gt;The Good Raised Up&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, John.</p>
<p>Not sure how I found your blog, but you might be interested to know that there is an entire &#8220;<a href="http://www.quakerquaker.org/quaker_blogs">Quaker blogosphere</a>&#8221; at your fingertips, and we explore some of the questions and observations you make in this post:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&#038;lr=&#038;q=quaker+blog+dressing+plain&#038;btnG=Search">dressing plain</a></p>
<p>being a &#8220;<a href="http://beppeblog.blogspot.com/2004/09/yet-more-light-on-can-i-be-quaker-and.html">hyphenated Quaker</a>&#8220;:  Jewish-Quaker, Buddhist-Quaker, etc.</p>
<p>what we do at <a href=http://thegoodraisedup.blogspot.com/2006/02/stages-of-worship.html">Meeting for Worship</a></p>
<p>etc.</p>
<p>Another resource for recent posts among Friends is the website <a href="http://www.quakerquaker.org">QuakerQuaker</a>.</p>
<p>Nice to learn some about the Church of Latter Day Saints while doing my blog-browsing tonight.</p>
<p>Blessings,<br />
Liz, <a href="http://thegoodraisedup.blogspot.com">The Good Raised Up</a></p>
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		<title>By: Gray</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-243</link>
		<dc:creator>Gray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2006 21:42:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-243</guid>
		<description>I did enjoy the Quakers, but I found myself wishing for more structure. Also, the homogeneity of the members bothered me, perhaps because they were so much like me. There was economic and ethnic diversity to be sure. Yet all of us who were over 30 had graduate degrees in health or human services, we all had been active in the same political causes, and most of us had invested in community supported agriculture.

I don&#039;t think that the quiet company of my clones would drive me forward as well as the irrepressible ferment of the UU stew.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did enjoy the Quakers, but I found myself wishing for more structure. Also, the homogeneity of the members bothered me, perhaps because they were so much like me. There was economic and ethnic diversity to be sure. Yet all of us who were over 30 had graduate degrees in health or human services, we all had been active in the same political causes, and most of us had invested in community supported agriculture.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think that the quiet company of my clones would drive me forward as well as the irrepressible ferment of the UU stew.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-242</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Feb 2006 01:19:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-242</guid>
		<description>Gray, I admire your multi-religion fluency.  I can relate to your sense of vulnerability and foreigness in some places of worship.  I think that&#039;s one of the things I&#039;m aiming for with this pilgrimage: becoming familiar with the basic (basic!) gestures and phrases from each religious culture and deliberately exposing myself to that first culture shock.

I&#039;ve really enjoyed the Unitarian Universalist services I&#039;ve attended (and people I&#039;ve met).  Until I found the Quakers, I think the UUs were my top choice for a potential rebound church (they&#039;re still a close second).  I&#039;m looking forward to visiting the Costa Mesa church in the next month or two.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gray, I admire your multi-religion fluency.  I can relate to your sense of vulnerability and foreigness in some places of worship.  I think that&#8217;s one of the things I&#8217;m aiming for with this pilgrimage: becoming familiar with the basic (basic!) gestures and phrases from each religious culture and deliberately exposing myself to that first culture shock.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve really enjoyed the Unitarian Universalist services I&#8217;ve attended (and people I&#8217;ve met).  Until I found the Quakers, I think the UUs were my top choice for a potential rebound church (they&#8217;re still a close second).  I&#8217;m looking forward to visiting the Costa Mesa church in the next month or two.</p>
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		<title>By: Gray</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-241</link>
		<dc:creator>Gray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Feb 2006 20:58:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-241</guid>
		<description>That was pretty interesting. Besides our Governor and the young guys who knock on my door, I don&#039;t think that I know any Mormans.

I am primarily familiar with the Unitarian church which I attend (Jews, and Catholic gays and lesbians are heavily represented), the liberal Presbyterian church of my youth, and with my wife&#039;s independent synagogue. I frequently play music for regional Episcopal churches and have several times visited the local Quakers.

I have enjoy meetings with the Friends. The congregations sounds similar, although the small meetinghouse is in a quiet area next to a park. It must be well over 150 years old. Most of them are also old friends in the secular sense. I fit in easily and have sometimes considered joining.

I have never really experienced prescriptive or hierarchical religion.

There are customs in Judaism that I follow when I am with my wife and daughter because they are my family and am respectful of them, but I am under no pressure to do so. I have a certain pride in the knowedge and comfort that I have achieved there, but I have a freedom denied to congregation members.

I often wonder what others might think of me and my congregation. Would a born again bible literalist hold hands with my gay friends while we prayed? Would a Mormon be puzzled by a public discussion of theology, where the congregation decided that two completely opposed interpretations of a point were ethically useful and should both be accepted as true? Would an observant Jew be surprized by the Mezuzah in the frame of our re-revolutionary door?

It&#039;s hard to be comfortable in a religious environment that is either much more prescriptive or much more flexible than your own. I feel very exposed and out of my element when confronted ith the mysteries of a Catholic church, an Orthodox synagogue, or a very conservative Christian church.

It sounds like you fit in easily.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That was pretty interesting. Besides our Governor and the young guys who knock on my door, I don&#8217;t think that I know any Mormans.</p>
<p>I am primarily familiar with the Unitarian church which I attend (Jews, and Catholic gays and lesbians are heavily represented), the liberal Presbyterian church of my youth, and with my wife&#8217;s independent synagogue. I frequently play music for regional Episcopal churches and have several times visited the local Quakers.</p>
<p>I have enjoy meetings with the Friends. The congregations sounds similar, although the small meetinghouse is in a quiet area next to a park. It must be well over 150 years old. Most of them are also old friends in the secular sense. I fit in easily and have sometimes considered joining.</p>
<p>I have never really experienced prescriptive or hierarchical religion.</p>
<p>There are customs in Judaism that I follow when I am with my wife and daughter because they are my family and am respectful of them, but I am under no pressure to do so. I have a certain pride in the knowedge and comfort that I have achieved there, but I have a freedom denied to congregation members.</p>
<p>I often wonder what others might think of me and my congregation. Would a born again bible literalist hold hands with my gay friends while we prayed? Would a Mormon be puzzled by a public discussion of theology, where the congregation decided that two completely opposed interpretations of a point were ethically useful and should both be accepted as true? Would an observant Jew be surprized by the Mezuzah in the frame of our re-revolutionary door?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s hard to be comfortable in a religious environment that is either much more prescriptive or much more flexible than your own. I feel very exposed and out of my element when confronted ith the mysteries of a Catholic church, an Orthodox synagogue, or a very conservative Christian church.</p>
<p>It sounds like you fit in easily.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-240</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Feb 2006 17:43:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-240</guid>
		<description>Kathy, thank you so much for your kind response.

I get nervous when writing these Pilgrimage posts because there&#039;s no way I could do any church or religion any justice within the space of even a long blog post.

Jana and I love our encounters with you and Guillermo and Sonia.  We do feel like we&#039;re fellow travelers, in many different ways--sometimes we get discouraged but then we talk to people like you and think, &quot;they&#039;re doing the same thing and they&#039;re all right.&quot; :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kathy, thank you so much for your kind response.</p>
<p>I get nervous when writing these Pilgrimage posts because there&#8217;s no way I could do any church or religion any justice within the space of even a long blog post.</p>
<p>Jana and I love our encounters with you and Guillermo and Sonia.  We do feel like we&#8217;re fellow travelers, in many different ways&#8211;sometimes we get discouraged but then we talk to people like you and think, &#8220;they&#8217;re doing the same thing and they&#8217;re all right.&#8221; <img src='http://www.mindonfire.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Kathy Quick</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-239</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathy Quick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Feb 2006 05:50:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mindonfire.com/dev/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/#comment-239</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m always so happy to see you, Jana, and your kids at OCFM or elsewhere. I don&#039;t know that I&#039;ve been all that deliberate about my spiritual journey, and certainly I&#039;ve been not nearly so thoughtful as you have, but many of the observations you&#039;ve made about Quakerism and the comments you&#039;ve made about what you like resonate deeply with me. The queries that were read at the end of meeting when you visited are probably my favorite part of the rituals of meeting. We circulate through them annually, reading one every first Sunday of the month, and they are often so provocative. It&#039;s been very interesting to follow through this blog your thoughts not only about religion but about returning to school, seeking meaning, and being a fully engaged family member, because I feel that we are in some ways fellow travelers. It&#039;s generous of you to share these thoughts through your blog, which I&#039;m glad to have just discovered is active again. And, while I can&#039;t speak for the OC Friends Meeting as a whole in any official capacity, I know that the other members and attenders, like me, are always happy to have your or other members of your family join us for worship or fellowship any time, however you would identify your religious hybrid affiliation in any given week! Kathy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m always so happy to see you, Jana, and your kids at OCFM or elsewhere. I don&#8217;t know that I&#8217;ve been all that deliberate about my spiritual journey, and certainly I&#8217;ve been not nearly so thoughtful as you have, but many of the observations you&#8217;ve made about Quakerism and the comments you&#8217;ve made about what you like resonate deeply with me. The queries that were read at the end of meeting when you visited are probably my favorite part of the rituals of meeting. We circulate through them annually, reading one every first Sunday of the month, and they are often so provocative. It&#8217;s been very interesting to follow through this blog your thoughts not only about religion but about returning to school, seeking meaning, and being a fully engaged family member, because I feel that we are in some ways fellow travelers. It&#8217;s generous of you to share these thoughts through your blog, which I&#8217;m glad to have just discovered is active again. And, while I can&#8217;t speak for the OC Friends Meeting as a whole in any official capacity, I know that the other members and attenders, like me, are always happy to have your or other members of your family join us for worship or fellowship any time, however you would identify your religious hybrid affiliation in any given week! Kathy</p>
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		<title>By: J</title>
		<link>http://www.mindonfire.com/2006/02/12/oc-pilgrimage-station-02-oc-friends-meeting/comment-page-1/#comment-238</link>
		<dc:creator>J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2006 02:03:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Good pics John!  I especially like the rainbow &#039;brella even tho it has little to do w/quakerism itself.

I love Quaker history and I enjoy Quaker practice.  Not sure if I like the &#039;decide everything by committe&#039; idea, tho-it seems like it might get old when nothing can get done quickly (I am a woman of action).

But I really love our Quaker &quot;Friends.&quot;  What an asset they&#039;ve been to our family :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good pics John!  I especially like the rainbow &#8216;brella even tho it has little to do w/quakerism itself.</p>
<p>I love Quaker history and I enjoy Quaker practice.  Not sure if I like the &#8216;decide everything by committe&#8217; idea, tho-it seems like it might get old when nothing can get done quickly (I am a woman of action).</p>
<p>But I really love our Quaker &#8220;Friends.&#8221;  What an asset they&#8217;ve been to our family <img src='http://www.mindonfire.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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